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  • Writer's pictureSusan Tatum

Improving Relationships in Business With Your Natural Number

with Susan and Martin Fisher, Co-Founders Body of 9

Have you ever wondered why your physical communication is so different from those around you? Susan and Martin Fisher share about their company, Body of 9, and the 9 physiological natural numbers that make up our attributes. We discuss how understanding your number can not only help you communicate more effectively but build better business and customer relationships by understanding the natural communication of others.

Notes from the Show

How can understanding your “Natural Number” and your physiological communication style change the way you operate in business? Susan and Martin Fisher are Co-Founders of The Body of 9, where they help individuals, couples, families, and businesses how to align with their own Natural Number, accept and work with other Natural Numbers, and fill in the missing essential elements by activating all 9 numbers within their own body.

No matter where you come from, what your race, culture or ethnicity are, and how you have been nurtured, your body is activated in one of nine regions that shape how you experience almost every aspect of your being. - The Body of 9

The 9 Natural Numbers

1 - Acceptance, Appreciation, Connection

2 - Relationships, Engagement, Movement

3 - Inspiration, Drive, Focus

4 - Alignment, Authenticity, Deep Connection

5 - Experience, Knowledge, Understanding

6 - Significance, Aliveness, Action

7 - Change, Honesty, Possibility

8 - Integrity, Safety, Trust

9 - Harmony, Integration, Balance

Susan and Martin discuss how they’ve worked with businesses to understand the natural numbers of team members and the transformation of communication is impressive. This process allows businesses to leverage skills and strengths and put the right people in the right positions.

To learn more about The Body of 9 visit their website full of resources and information.

What's Inside:

  • Improving communications & effectiveness by understanding there are nine physiologically different kinds of people.

  • The dangers of interpreting body language the same way for everyone.

  • What learning to activate all 9 centers of your body does for you.

  • What you need to know to communicate better with your family

  • Is it important to have all 9 numbers represented in your company?

Mentioned in this Episode:

Transcribed by AI Susan Tatum 0:38

welcome back today my guests are Susan Bennett Fisher and Martin Fisher from the body of nine. And these are two very interesting people with a very interesting concept that I am really looking forward to this conversation, Susan, and Martin, welcome. And thank you for being here. Good to see you.

Susan Bennett Fisher 0:56


Susan Tatum 0:57

So tell us a little bit more than I just said about what the body of nine is and what you're doing.

Susan Bennett Fisher 1:02

So body of 9 is a company. And Martin and I've been studying and researching and teaching about a discovery about humanity, that there are nine physiologically different kinds of people. And what this translates into on a business perspective is, it's a body based assessment system. So if you look at a Myers Briggs, or Enneagram, they probably come from the same truth. That there are nine physiologically different kinds of people. And we take in information differently, we do different things, we have different skills, we have different ways of interacting, but they're very specific based off your natural number. And so we have researched this for 20 plus years together, and with people from all over the world, 50 nationalities, and across this culture, race, gender, doesn't matter what you are in any of those aspects, you have a natural number.

Martin Fisher 1:53

So basically, there are nine centers in our body, one of them is born active. And it shapes your physical relationship, spiritual reality. And so even though there are 7 billion people in the world, there's actually only nine ways that people show up.

Susan Bennett Fisher 2:07

So what this means in business is, you can improve team relationships. By understanding this, you can improve your marketing messages out into the world, you can improve your customer support, and selling relationships, because you can know more quickly and easily. It's like a shortcut to knowing what you need.

Martin Fisher 2:28

And a simple example would be that half the people in the world actually prefer relationship over transaction. So that half the people you meet, I kind of like and one eye contact as part of the relationship building process. And we work with realtors all the time, because one of the things that Realtors need to know is that half the people they work with really want the relationship Oh, and by the way, we want to sell or buy a house, the other half don't care about relationships, they just want the transaction. And just knowing that to start, because we've all been taught that eye contact is really, really important. If you don't get eye contact, you're not being respectful. That's actually not the case

Susan Bennett Fisher 2:31

for half the population. And the other half of the population can't offer you their gift unless you actually stop and look them in the eye. And that's one of the you know, central misunderstandings out there in the world, this assumption that we use our body language language in the same way.

Martin Fisher 3:14

Yeah, so for everyone out there listening, the one thing to take away from us is that there are nine different kinds of people. Yeah, you and your family are different. You and the people you work with are different. Your clients are different than you are. And if you just expect them to think the same way that you do and want the same thing as you do, you're going to start off at a disadvantage.

Susan Tatum 3:29

I can certainly agree with that. And the first time that I that you and I talked, we learned that I was a natural number five, and that, that I and the rest of my fellow fives, I guess, have to look up to think,

Martin Fisher 3:48

well, actually, I'm gonna show number five as well. So we share that we are sort of brothers under natural number five, if you will, but we actually don't have to look up the thing. It's part of the markers of what we do. So as an answer to number five, and five is at the top of the head of the three and three in the chest and three in the lower body. But number five is we do look up to think, and it's just part of what we do is a natural number. It's not required, but it's just what we do.

Susan Bennett Fisher 4:15

Yeah, so the eyes, that taking information with the eye is distracting for five if they're trying to process and do something

Susan Tatum 4:20

totally. So since I started noticing that I and you and someone else that was on the call Ashley was one that needs that eye contact. So I've been trying to do more of it. And I can't think when I'm looking at somebody,

Martin Fisher 4:36

The other thing that Number five's doing that you've probably experienced there's no people that are with you. They'll notice your eyes go blank. Sometimes you can be scanning, but you're thinking there's nobody home, because that's how

Susan Bennett Fisher 4:48

it looks to other people. If you if you take a room of people and you're divided into the five through nines, and the ones through fours you put them on either half of the room and you look to the one two threes and fours the fives just have a nice look like they're dead in their eyes almost. Whereas all one two threes and fours are looking to create some kind of connection out in the world with other people

Martin Fisher 5:09

and one of the things that we do 4 9 is teach other people how to activate all nine centers in our body, because we all have all nine. Takes a couple of weeks but with a fairly simple set of exercises, because it's physical. We can teach people how to move that part of the body because it's all about what bones, what muscles, what fascia, and what intention is there to make things happen,

Susan Bennett Fisher 5:30

because there's a specific activation in the body that creates a particular way of proceeding. So when you activate five, by stretching up the back of the head and opening the crown, you're more aware of your environment, for example, 360 degree awareness kicks in. But if you take that away, that just disappears.

Susan Tatum 5:49

So if, by doing this work, then it would be possible for me to communicate with somebody that needs to have eye contact.

Martin Fisher 5:58

Because just by changing the way that you move your body, for example, if Susan and I were going to activate natural number two, which we will, then we can look at you and we're smiling, we're connecting to

Susan Bennett Fisher 6:08

and we're engaging,

Martin Fisher 6:09

and we're engaging just by literally pushing out.

Susan Bennett Fisher 6:13

Yeah, just learning how to activate that part of the body. And it creates a different way of being it lightens up our eyes and brings more energy into our bodies, so that we are more outward bound, then, so let's just go back to our regular selves.

Martin Fisher 6:27

Nobody changes.

Susan Bennett Fisher 6:28

to regular selves.

Susan Tatum 6:29

Oh, yeah.

Susan Bennett Fisher 6:30

We're still nice people we are not engaging, engaging it.

Martin Fisher 6:33

Yeah. So one of the things about an actual number five, and you may or may not have had experiences that when I was growing up, I wanted to be a programmer worked with computers, so that I could turn them off, when they were annoying to me, because people were a real pain in the butt. They're always wanting somebody for me, I'm always having to do things. And with one person, it's okay to people gets tough. By the time you're working with three or four people, it's like, I can't deal with it. Because you all want something different, I can't help you. Yeah, I've learned is that being with other people is fantastic. I've really learned to love being with other people, because it's just joyful to be in connection with somebody else. And so

Susan Bennett Fisher 7:09

when you remember.

Martin Fisher 7:10

And so our ability to be the whole human being is available to us, we like to we like to sort of not joke, really say that it was a way for humanity to evolve, is to know that we can be nine times bigger than when you're better and more powerful and more aware, more attractive than we can't be all

Susan Bennett Fisher 7:29

we're so limited, first by our unconsciousness that we don't know this about ourselves. But once you know about yourself, you can begin to develop the skill that's associated with you and your body. And to honor and be acknowledged in that place as well. For me as a natural number six, I always talk about having been criticized my whole life for being fast and loud. Well, those are attributes of my physiology, my chest vibrates, and my voice carries. Even if I'm trying to be quiet, my voice still carries. And, you know, as a young woman was like, Susan, you're so loud. And all that was awful, you know. So I tried to shrink into and quiet myself, which is not my natural way. And also my intensity, the intensity I live within is part of being a six as part of my ability to do what six does in the world. So we lose our connection to our nature, as our nurture layers on top and disconnects us. So this, this recovery of who you are, at that level, is very acknowledging, and very freeing.

Martin Fisher 8:27

One of the most astounding things to us that we discovered in our research, when we work with a 1000s on people is that the numbers don't repeat in families. So you, your brothers, and your sisters, and your parents all have a different natural number. Alternately, you your partner, and your children similarly all have a different natural number. And which means that not knowing this, you unconsciously can make your children long for being themselves and not one of them for the gifts that they give to the world. And that's that's kind of disappointing.

Susan Bennett Fisher 8:57

Yeah, we work with a lot of relationship coaches and stuff and, and they'll they'll have parents and children that are resigned to the fact that they can't communicate. And you see these perpetual kind of expressions like, Oh, she's doing it again. And there's this frustration of communication between parents and children. And the same thing can happen in the workplace.

Martin Fisher 9:19

Yeah, we love working with families, we love working with businesses, because we worked with a company just the other day there was 14 people in there. And after we left, every one of the people we work with came back and said, you know, we've things are getting better, we're enjoying working together better, we're more in it's more lively, we're getting more stuff done. It's just this ability to communicate as I'm sure your listeners know. Anywhere between 50% and 80% of how we communicate is body based on body language if you will,

Susan Bennett Fisher 9:48

and the body language gets misunderstood by

Martin Fisher 9:50

the end the rest of it is tone and the rest of his the words but the words we use me nine different ways. The tone is very specific. You can tell Susan the tone is different than

Susan Bennett Fisher 9:59

my high tone he's very fluffy

Martin Fisher 10:10

And vocally as well. Yes. As well body language. So just understanding for example, Susan you being number five for since the last I guess it's been a week since we saw you. You're more five like I'll bet dollars to donuts, that the people you're working with you They understand you better and you're understanding them better because you're communicating body to body more clearly,

Susan Bennett Fisher 10:22

yes, more authentically aligned with who you are. Yeah,

Susan Tatum 10:25


Susan Bennett Fisher 10:26

So that's, that's the start. And in the workplace, if you cultivate that understanding, and when we did this company nav attack here in town, oh, I have permission. Yeah, they've given us permission to tell everybody about how impactful it's been for them, the leader is a sixth. And there's a lot of natural number ones in his organization. And those ones need much more positive support than the average person. They're very creative. But they also get stuck in their own perfectionism. And so he knows that, so he can go there and say, Oh, good, we've come far enough on this, this is beautiful, is far enough. Let's move on to the next thing. So he goes in there as a six, and feels into what's important, what's done, what's next. And he manages the productivity, because that's his great strength. But these ones are creating this beautiful work for him, that he can then go out and take to customers and say, Look at this beautiful work that I have for you. And so it's a way of understanding how do I leverage the skills and strengths of the people that work for me and get the right people in the right positions, you know, their accountant is a five, that's great, she's holding the big picture, she's handling all of the, you know, the overall arching structure of the company. So it's, it's, uh, you know, anybody, we say anybody can do any job, that's very important. We don't want anybody to be natural number. So that's not good. But the way you're going to do it, it's really important to understand that.

Martin Fisher 11:43

And also, you know, how to hold people responsible. Because in any organization, sometimes you get some people that really weren't feeling it, when they came into work this morning. Maybe they've had a bad day, maybe they've been up all night with the pet or something. But knowing what people can be responsible for, you can basically say, look, you're not doing your thing today, is there something I can help you with? So knowing that when someone is able to do what we sometimes refer to is your superpower, versus when there's people just phoning it in? And every business has people sometimes at a phone, sometimes for reasons, but sometimes not. And so just knowing what the how people could do things and what their strengths are, because if we don't turn up, and we're going back to this body to body communication, our bodies know this about each other. And so if you go to work, it's like, well, I'm not really, I'm just gonna sit here in this room and not participate in this meeting, what you're actually withholding your gift from the rest of the organization. And maybe you've got a reason to do that. But if everyone in the organization knows everyone's natural numbers, like, well, Martin, I need your big picture. Don't just sit there, because you'll be sitting in a meeting. And you may be thinking, Well, why doesn't somebody say this? Because everyone's got to know what I'm thinking. No, they don't?

Susan Tatum 12:54

Oh, interesting.

Susan Bennett Fisher 12:57

Right? We had this assumption that what what is obvious to us is obvious to everyone. But it's not because you're actually tapping in different frequency of information. And you have different different thing that you do.

Martin Fisher 13:10

When you're collecting data differently. That's part of your different information is that Susan collects things and she knows what's most alive, I have no idea what's most alive, but I know sure as heck, what needs to be fixed, or what we need to learn before we can achieve something.

Susan Bennett Fisher 13:22

Right? It's just some information is missing. He knows

Susan Tatum 13:26

We have to Susan's on this conversation, which may be may get confusing to those who are listening. There is there is me, Susan, who is a number five and there is Susan Bennett. Sorry, Susan, you have was number two, the expert in this area where one of the things you guys said, you know, that that struck me was you refer to an accountant, the accountant woman as being a number five as well. And usually, when you're doing like this assessment, the other assessment things, I mean, I would never in my whole life been putting the same same category as an accountant. I just don't think

Susan Bennett Fisher 14:06

it's an example of a you could do any job. So the way she's doing the accounting job, because she chose that job is she uses her five skill, her big picture, understanding, her ability to organize and create a framework of data, her curiosity as to what's going on in the company. So she uses the attributes of five to do the counting in a particular way.

Susan Tatum 14:28

Okay, so when you are when you're working with clients, and then you were saying you're able, we're all we all have these all numbers inside of us, and we're able to call upon them or pull them up or something like that. What happens if everybody and if everybody's trying to do everybody else's number? I mean, how do you

Martin Fisher 14:47

most of the time, you don't need to, right, so one of the things that we do when we go to a company is we'll find out, do you have nine natural numbers in your company? Some do? Most don't, because most of the people we work with are sort of 20, 10, 15, 30 people companies and so

Susan Bennett Fisher 15:04

they may be missing one natural number right?

Martin Fisher 15:06

So sometimes that well if you need this particular function And when you guys are some of you are going to have to make your body do it. And it's like being blind you as soon as you try and be. So when I first started doing that for number two's what we were doing earlier, it was amazing to me because it was all about eye contact, I wasn't thinking there was nothing else. You know, Susan has a natural number five, we have pretty much 360 degree awareness, we can focus on conversations behind us. But when doing natural opportunity, there is nothing except you and the person in front of you. And so it's very hard to bring in that energy. But sometimes, if you're missing it, you need to know what you're missing. And sometimes it can be really important, there are certain because each natural number brings a superpower their own gift. Without it. Organizations can struggle because literally not every view has been taken into consideration.

Susan Bennett Fisher 15:51

Right? Yeah. And in the organization we worked with, they were missing three and four, which are two of the connector energies. So they were missing focus on joy, which is what three brings, and who to connect with who and authenticity, which is what four brings. So there was nobody holding the torch for those things. And that organization, they're doing just fine. They don't necessarily need that in this current moment. But if they're thinking about growing, or they're thinking about expanding their client relationships, bringing those energies in consciously could actually assist the balance in their organization.

Susan Tatum 16:23

So to ask, because I'm curious, even though I think we said that was maybe not the best word to use.

Susan Bennett Fisher 16:29

But this is a great word.

Susan Tatum 16:31

Well, I think it's a great word too but somebody last time I talked to you guys somebody had told me curious was a I'd read it somewhere, it was now a buzzword that salespeople use. So we we don't trust anybody that's using the word curious or something like that. But where did this all come from? I mean, how have you been setting this for 30 years, you said, Susan?

Susan Bennett Fisher 16:48

I found out my natural number in 2002, as part of the leadership training program, the people who had made the first observation had started with a version of the Enneagram in martial arts, and they noticed that they had classified our study group of people, and they were doing some martial arts exercises. And notice that people were doing weird things to become strong. But then they recognize they were doing the same were things based on how they had identified them. So that was the first one, the guy who who was doing this was a five, and he went, Oh, my God, could there be a physical component to the way we will relate to each other that we don't know about in the world today. So he began researching that I studied with them for nine years. And then in 2012, Martin and I decided we needed to take the research in a different direction, and work with way more people. And that's where we started to dig into the differences in the physiologies, the muscles bones that we use to activate the attributes and discriptions of all evolved and developed from the 7000 people that we've worked with personally, hand to hand.

Martin Fisher 17:50

Yeah, and but if you go further back, if you look at some of the statues in Egypt, 3500 BC, you can see some of the statues are showing

Susan Bennett Fisher 17:57

the various postures and gestures and facial expression,

Martin Fisher 18:00

all the natural numbers. So this is not new made up for humanity. 100 years ago, kind of when Gurdjieff brought it back as part of the Enneagram. This goes back way, way, way, way further, if you look at the Indian continent, they they have some things they use similar to this they use for arranged marriages, the Chinese know about it. So this is not new information. It's just remembering old information that got lost.

Susan Bennett Fisher 18:24

I mean, it's it's been probably true about human beings since we came into being at some level. It's, it raises a lot of rather interesting questions on the back end here if you start thinking about it, but we maybe don't want to go there. context of the business discussion.

Susan Tatum 18:40

But I have to ask, because you're saying that there's not there, the number does not repeat in the family, unless you get more than nine. Right? How can that be?

Susan Bennett Fisher 18:50

We don't know.

Martin Fisher 18:52

We got some ideas. But so we started look at the world of epigenetics.

Susan Tatum 18:59

What does that mean

Martin Fisher 19:00

So the way that DNA is massaged, if you will, is through the world of epigenetics. And there was some discoveries many years ago in the 70s, that if you do enough meditation, you can change how your offspring turn up. And there's some quite well respected research that says that mothers that are hungry, build bigger children versus mothers that are plenty of food builds small children, something like that.

Susan Bennett Fisher 19:28

to put on less weight to put on weight more easily if they have to hungry parents

Martin Fisher 19:33

Right, thank you. So our environment dramatically changed shapes how our children ourselves and our children grow.

Susan Bennett Fisher 19:40

Here's also some thoughts on past life traumas and past life experiences transferring through the epigenetics intergenerationally you know, it's just beginning research in those areas. But what we see is natural number seems to repeat it firstborns from the grandparents. So my oldest is the same as my father, my sister's oldest is also the same as my father.

Martin Fisher 20:06

So we don't want to get too much down.

Susan Tatum 20:09

And I could go down a rabbit hole asking you questions.

Martin Fisher 20:12

But what we do know, we do know that the numbers mean things we didn't make up the numbers, we don't know where they came from. But they are very well defined relationships between the numbers and the tribe, the bears, and

Susan Bennett Fisher 20:25

we got a numerology of it actually, is indicative of what the meaning of the numbers is indicative of relationships, predictive

Martin Fisher 20:31

right, so so there's a lot of other things in here that move into the in terms of research versus in terms of business knowledge, giving information to people that are starting and running businesses. So if people are working with other people, the message, of course, is your clients are probably not like you. They want something and need to be worked with differently than you do. And if you say why, if you think they're looking for something that you can give them in the way that you give them without talking about more directly, and that understanding, then you're going to be have a real problem making those connections. And one of the primary ones that we like to talk about is natural number eight, people naturally eight need you to do what you say you're gonna do.

Susan Bennett Fisher 21:11

When you said, you were gonna do

Martin Fisher 21:12

when you said you're gonna do it, and that makes common sense for most of us. But as it turns out, one night, the population is like that. And if you have a customer or potential client, that you don't do that with, you'll lose that client.

Susan Bennett Fisher 21:23

It's one of the reasons why when you go into meeting one day, your sales presentation completely works. Everything lines up and just works one day. And then the next meeting that you go into, it just completely falls flat. And it's almost like you're like, Well, I just said the very same thing to person A that I said to person B, why did it only work with Person A. This gives you clues as to why that's the case.

Martin Fisher 21:43

So but the other side of it is that talking to people and attracting people getting the marketing message to people is actually nine times harder than you think it is. You can connect to people with your message very easily. Susan natural number five, that's number five's like myself here, you understand you no question about it.

Susan Bennett Fisher 22:02

And every five that would be listening to this call would actually want us to ask more questions and answer more of the questions that are coming up for you. The other natural numbers not so much.

Susan Tatum 22:11

I like wouldn't she shut up? And let's go on and do something else.

Susan Bennett Fisher 22:14

Yeah, tell me something else, you know.

Susan Tatum 22:17

So, um, I was having conversation with somebody recently, we're talking about trust. And it was just so important when you're selling services that you have the building that trust with your clients, and, you know, the people that you work with. And one of the things that that this particular person said it was really important to her is that do you do what you tell me you're gonna do? That's that?

Susan Bennett Fisher 22:40

probably an 8

Susan Tatum 22:41

I wonder, because I went right along with her. And I'm thinking well, yeah, alright, so that's how you build trust, you do what you say you're going to do. And if you say you're gonna do something, and you don't do it, you're gonna lose every you're gonna lose trust from anybody.

Susan Bennett Fisher 22:56

Well, that's actually not completely true. No reason for not having done what you said. And you have explained it. And yeah,

Susan Tatum 23:04

so many indications.

Susan Bennett Fisher 23:05

Yeah, even an eight will forgive you. But if you do it too many times, or it's a pattern, or, but But you often will see things like six and eight is, you know, we'll just take this as a six, I do what's most alive. So I might say to my natural number eight daughter, she'll say, Well, you do this with me, mom? And I'll say, yeah, probably she hears the Yes. And then tomorrow, it's like, I'm like, No, I can't do it. I got meetings. She said, Well, you had meetings yesterday. Yeah, I might have. But I'm not really thinking about my meetings yesterday, because so I don't think through the way she does. And I don't make commitments the way she does.

Martin Fisher 23:42

And as there are nine different kinds of people.

Susan Bennett Fisher 23:44

And I'm not untrustworthy,

Martin Fisher 23:46

there are various people and various your clients but if you say you're going to do something, you're not going to do it. As long as you call up and say, Hi, how you doing? Let's go and have coffee. They really don't care what you're going to do when you say you're going to do it, as long as there's the connection made, is what is most important to each verse remembers, right? And trust is absolutely number one.

Susan Bennett Fisher 24:04

Very important But but it's very different. How you establish trust with each of the natural numbers.

Martin Fisher 24:07

No matter what surprises absolutely true. But does that mean that your relationship with your manager is based on the trust? Or is it based on a lot of other things? It really depends on the people in your organization,

Susan Bennett Fisher 24:22

right? What their natural numbers are, how they take in information, what they care about how they build relationship. So this is one of the troubles out there Susan is that we assume that if this is what how we do it that everybody else basically does it that way

Susan Tatum 24:35


Susan Bennett Fishe 24:36

And that's gonna get you into trouble all the time.

Susan Tatum 24:38

So yeah, so you guys did was it like a two man ended exercise with me when we first met and determined that I was a natural five, and I have no reason to believe that that's not absolutely 100%. Correct. But can you teach people? So I understand, you go in and you work with a company, you can test everybody and say, What so are these people? This is this, and this is this, but now we're talking about communicating with our clients. Can you teach people? Like, could you teach me to read someone else and know how I need to communicate with them or how

Martin Fisher 25:12

it takes a long time, because learning how to activate you. And first of all, you need to have one on your body. Because while you can probably get 50% of the population and the other 50% take a lot of work unless you really know all nine in your body. And we teach that. And it's probably its worst case, a six month course, we can normally do it in less than that. And then once you put them in your body, and since it's a physical process, you need to practice. Once you've done that we can teach you how to identify, and we have we have classes, they one, one twice, twice a year, and we just been

Susan Bennett Fisher 25:43

classes out there constantly running and joining anytime,

Martin Fisher 25:46

but but we teach people to be able to identify, and people go out there and they identify and spread the word because

Susan Bennett Fisher 25:52

we're we're working a lot with coaches and holistic practitioners right now who are already doing holistic work with people helping them to grow and develop. So they're just integrating this into what they're doing. And it's very powerful when you integrate it into what you're doing. Because it helps everything happen more easily and more. more easily, and more happily.

Martin Fisher 26:14

But yeah, and the other side, we do these courses called how your body informs you, which is very simply, you can put people off into buckets. These people are more interested in relationship, which shows let's do the relationship thing. Are these people more interested in shared experiences? Well, let's do that. So you can have a wide brush pretty easily.

Susan Bennett Fisher 26:31

Yes. And when we go into an organization, we teach much more basic skills like okay, let's let's focus on the eyes. Let's look at the eyes. And so I'll do exercises like put all the connectors on one, two threes, fours on one side and everybody else on the other side, so they can see the difference. Because you can see in the eye the quality of it tells you so much about the person you're dealing with when you start to be aware of it, then you say okay, what's the face shape, six is having have material between the nose and the more material here, I call it, the jowls of six, sevens have flatness underneath their eye. So there's all these little micro expressions and parts of your physiology part of how we could tell, it's like the back of your head is a little bigger than this part of your head, your eyes are around, they're observing, you have an upper confidence, you're not looking worried about looking at the camera to make sure you're making eye contact with us

Martin Fisher 27:22

and look where Susan's gesturing Susan gestures

Susan Bennett Fisher 27:26

yeah. So there's so many towels, there's so much information that's constantly coming at you. And once you become aware of it, it's almost like you can't, you can't on become aware of it. And then you start to get curious, I get so many people that after they get identified, they're like, I think my mother has this. And I think my father is this. The sad part is with our parents and our families were almost always wrong. They're the hardest for us to get all of them. But the impact of knowing is tremendous.

Susan Tatum 27:50

Yeah, it's really it's really interesting. And I there were so many other questions that I want to ask you guys. And we're running out of time.

Martin Fisher 28:00

So let's do another one.

Susan Bennett Fisher 28:00

Well, let's we can do another one with you Susan.

Susan Tatum 28:02

But quickly, how can people follow up with you guys to learn more about what you're doing?

Susan Bennett Fisher 28:10

Susan Tatum 28:13

And that's the number 9

Susan Bennett Fisher 28:13

we've we've two books we've written about it. The Body of 9: Decode Your Natural Physiology, and discover your true self that has basically all of our research describes the system in the hole described each of the natural numbers. And then we have Body of 9 - Practices For Presence, which is how do you use this? How do you develop your observational skills, your courage, your way of being your awareness of your and creating choice, and how you interact in the world.

Martin Fisher 28:42

That's actually also an audio book available on our website. It is

Susan Bennett Fisher 28:44

Okay, and our training courses are there and you could go to book an individual or a couple or family identification on the website. So everything you need is really on the website.

Susan Tatum 28:58

Okay, so you work with businesses you work with, I'll say consumers, you also work with the therapists and coaches and and those types of folks that would then use it with their clients.

Martin Fisher 29:11

Yes, executive coaches as well as sort of more personal coaches. So huge range. Anyone who are growing all the time anyone that works with people or has families, which is Yeah.

Susan Tatum 29:22

Yeah, pretty much all of us. For those that are listening and not and can't see the logo back here. It's bodyof9 the number nine and that that's in your website address so we'll put that we'll put all of that in the show notes and Susan and Martin thank you so much for being here it's it's really really fascinating and I hope the listeners got as much out of it as I did



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